Newton's screaming problems

[Spyke]

Hey forum,
Thought i'd post a short text on how it's going with my Meyers parrot, and ask for a little advice.
I bought this little guy from a breeder last Saturday. He's not been hand fed.

He became 3 months old yesterday, so his baby floof is still going strong.

What i find wierd about this little guy is that he has absolutely no fear of hands! Nothing. I've had him walking all over my hands in hunt of sunflower seeds. He is afraid of me though. We are slowly making progress, but he is still very jumpy when it comes to sounds and movements.

Today, i opened the top of the cage, which makes a nice platform. I managed to get him on my hand and place him on the cage door. I fed him some sunflower seeds before getting him back in. I'm terrified of him getting scared and taking flight. I am not sure he feels safe around me yet.

So i wanted to ask you guys for experience. Should i wait for him to do something specific before progressing? Or keep making him walk on my hands inside the cage before progressing? When is generally a good time to try taking baby parrots out of the cage?

[Pajarita]

I am not sure I understand you... How often do you take him out and for how long? Also, are you providing soft foods for him? Are you spending hours with him just keeping him company? How does he react to this? I am trying to figure out why you say he is afraid of you but not your hands but baby birds that were syringe or pipette fed are not afraid of hands so nothing to worry there, this is perfectly normal.

[Spyke]

I am not sure I understand you... How often do you take him out and for how long? Also, are you providing soft foods for him? Are you spending hours with him just keeping him company? How does he react to this? I am trying to figure out why you say he is afraid of you but not your hands but baby birds that were syringe or pipette fed are not afraid of hands so nothing to worry there, this is perfectly normal.

Today is the first time I had him out of the cage. The cage door opens horizontally, so I had him sitting on that for about half a minute before I ticked him back in with treats. He always has a good bowl in his cage. He is not too excited about his food bowl without sunflower seeds. The thing is that he doesn't mind my hands at all, I can touch his beak, stroke his feet, feed him with my fingers without him showing any kind of discomfort. But he is afraid of my face and body. He was not syringe or pipette fed.

[Pajarita]

Not syringe or pipette fed? Do you mean he was gavage-fed? Because unless it was fed out of a spoon (which is never recommended), it must have been fed somehow and the possibility of it been a parent-raised bird and not been afraid of hands is zero to very low.

It needs to be with you for hours every day, this is a baby and they need the closeness, warmth and comfort of another living body or they grow up disaffected and end up having psychological problems (they are like human babies, they need company and touch to feel secure). It also needs soft food, all babies do (have you heard of the abundance method of weaning?). This is also the perfect time to teach the baby to eat a good, healthy diet so, please, no free-feeding seeds, especially sunflowers or you will create a seed junkie. You can feed seeds but only a measured amount of a good quality, low protein mix for dinner.

[Wolf]

There is much more of this that I do not understand than that which I do understand. About all that I can say with any certainty at this point is that you may be pushing too fast. It is good that he does not appear to be afraid of your hands and I would work on that as long as he is stepping up voluntarily and just add in the verbal cue to step up. After being with you for 5 days he is still pretty much scared of his environment as everything is so so new to him and for a bird that is a frightening place to be.
We would love to be more helpful to you and him and to that end the more that you can tell us about him both from before you got him and what his current life is like, the better we can help you. All birds are individual and so their responses are also individual responses.

[Spyke]

My apologies for being so unclear.

Newton is parent fed from the day he hatched, then moved to the breeders living room once he managed to eat on his own. (Hence why i said "not hand fed). As far as i know, he hasn't had any "close" human contact before moving in with me.

I spend hours each day besides his cage, talking to him and doing interval training where i have him step up on my hand for a sunflower seed reward. I do not starve him for training. He always has a bowl with parrot mix and pellets in his cage, also of course fresh water. He has never bit me either, only tasting and exploring my hand.

As Pajarita said, it's quite wierd that he has almost no fear of hands. I could give him sunflower seeds from my fingers the first time i was allowed to approach his cage. He has his own large cage in the living room, fitted with lots of toys and braches for him to explore. He spends most of his time on a yellow concrete perch in the top right corner of the cage, or climb around the roof. He has yet to show any interest in the toys.

He is very interested in me when he thinks i have sunflower seeds for him. But as far as i can see, it does not look like he has much interest in me beyond that.

My origin question was what i should look for as a sign to progress? I would of course love to take him out of the cage, but i am too afraid of him getting spooked and taking flight. Any suggestions on what i should do to bond with him?

[Wolf]

Well I would like to suggest several changes in your procedures. The first thing that I would do with him is to change his diet. I would feed him a fresh raw veggie, a fresh fruit and a fresh leafy green first ting in the morning followed about an hour later with a food that we call gloop, you can learn all about it using the search box in the nutrition section of this forum. It is basically a cooked food consisting of whole grains and vegetables with a few white beans and lentils or other legumes. and then feed him about a 1/4 to 1/3 cup of a seed mix for dinner. I would definitely not free feed pellets and seeds to him as this will end with him getting liver disease, or heart disease or kidney disease to name a few.
I would spend most of the time with him just hanging out and talking with him and offering him the chance to step up and climb about on me ( at least an hour each day). Training is good but at this early of your relationship I think that getting him acclimated to me and wanting to spend time with and on me would be the most important. It would be a big help when he starts to try his wings if he is trying them to come to you. The gaining the birds trust and bonding is the most important thing that you can do with him as it is the foundation for all that will come later and there is plenty of time for training later. Maybe reduce your training schedule to one ten or fifteen minute session per day until you have gained the birds trust and started to establish your bond and then slowly increase your training to two or three times per day.

[Spyke]

Well I would like to suggest several changes in your procedures. The first thing that I would do with him is to change his diet. I would feed him a fresh raw veggie, a fresh fruit and a fresh leafy green first ting in the morning followed about an hour later with a food that we call gloop, you can learn all about it using the search box in the nutrition section of this forum. It is basically a cooked food consisting of whole grains and vegetables with a few white beans and lentils or other legumes. and then feed him about a 1/4 to 1/3 cup of a seed mix for dinner. I would definitely not free feed pellets and seeds to him as this will end with him getting liver disease, or heart disease or kidney disease to name a few.
I would spend most of the time with him just hanging out and talking with him and offering him the chance to step up and climb about on me ( at least an hour each day). Training is good but at this early of your relationship I think that getting him acclimated to me and wanting to spend time with and on me would be the most important. It would be a big help when he starts to try his wings if he is trying them to come to you. The gaining the birds trust and bonding is the most important thing that you can do with him as it is the foundation for all that will come later and there is plenty of time for training later. Maybe reduce your training schedule to one ten or fifteen minute session per day until you have gained the birds trust and started to establish your bond and then slowly increase your training to two or three times per day.

Thanks Wolf! That is great advice. I'll make him some gloop first thing tomorrow. I have been offering him all kinds of fruits and veggies, but there seems to be no interest. One bite, and it drops to the floor. He takes a few pieces of apple every now and then.

This climbing and hanging out, this should take place inside the cage?

I've been following "Basics of Parrot Taming and Training" by Michael. But i feel there is something missing between the "determining treats for your parrot" and "getting parrot out of cage for the first time". Michael describes the "target training" method, which i have been using for getting Newton onto the cage door, but i dare not progressing.

Just to be clear here, i am in no rush. Want to make sure i do this whole process right.

[Wolf]

This is due to the weaning process that was used, they did not wean him onto fresh foods as for a breeder or pet store it is too expensive so they only wean to seeds and/ or pellets and leave it to you to figure out that he needs these other foods and how to get him to eat it.
Feeding him gloop is going to be like trying to get him to eat anything else as he needs to learn that it is food. For that reason start him with a variety of five or six whole grains cooked to the point that they are soft on the outside and still hard in the middle. Serve this either very slightly warm or room temperature and mix some of his normal food into it until you know that he is eating the cooked grains. Give him a fresh veggie, a fresh fruit and a leafy green first, then the grains and let him work on that all day and then give him his normal ration of seeds for dinner and remove the seeds when he goes to sleep at night. You want him to be hungry enough in the mornings to try his fresh foods and his grains. Using this way he should start eating the grains in a few days.
When he starts eating the grains reduce the amount of seeds in it and add his first cooked vegetable, usually sweet corn is a good place to start and when he eats the grain and the corn reduce the seeds again and add peas follow the same procedure and the third time don't add the seeds but keep adding vegetables to the mix. Then make a regular batch of gloop and you have him on a healthy diet.

[liz]

Parrot proof (no way you can do it completely) the room he is in. When you think you got it close the door and open his cage. Let him fly and watch to see what you missed while parrot proofing.
Flying is the best exersize. Flying burns off energy. Flying is security. He will land on you this way.
My cockatiels are basically all rescues. Some are new rescues and have not yet learned from the flock that I am safe. I just gave them their own room. In other words I walk into their cage. They fly all around me and perch where they want (on me). My sister Becky was in the room helping me set it up. Cagney, who I have not worked with, landed on her chest and stayed there. She petted him and kissed him on the head. He just stayed until she encouraged him to fly again.

I love it. They are doing exactly what I had hoped they would. To my surprise, Phoenix can fly. He doesn't fly good and he doesn't fly straight but is able to fly to the rope that I hung swings on.
I was afraid I would have to trim his feathers to put him in balance.