Breeder said I should catch my bird and hold it.

[meinenj]

Got my hand raised lovebird one week ago. Had thought it would be hand tamed, but I was wrong. When I arrived, the breeder caught the bird and clipped its wings. I then took her home. She was understandably stressed after all that, so I gave her a full 24 hours to acclimate to her new cage. I then began working with her to slowly get her used to my hand, tempting her with millet. She is eating well, and playing just a little with her toys.
Yesterday morning, a reflection from the window spooked her while my hand was in her cage, and she acted as frightened as the first day. I called the breeder.
She told me lovebirds can be stubborn and that I should catch the bird and hold her close to me until she calms down so she can get accustomed to me. So I tried it yesterday afternoon and today. I got nipped several times; I said ouch but didn't jerk away. She did actually seem okay with the back of my hand being next to her today, but is very frightened of my open palm.
Can this be right to catch her and condition her to my touch?
I have never hand tamed a bird; I owned a Senegal many years ago, and he was hand tamed when I bought him.
I am so confused.

Nancy

[Wolf]

Do not do this to your bird, it only forces the bird to realise that you will not listen to it and it will always be afraid of you and even though it will resign itself to this behavior from you for a while it will backfire on you and you will end up with a bird that you can not touch or handle at all.
If you want a good relationship with your bird, understand that it is intelligent ( one of the reasons we get birds) and respect this in the bird and earn its trust by never forcing it to do anything. Hang out with the bird, talk to the bird, offer the bird treats off and on while you do this and let the bird come to you on its own and it will do so when it is ready.

[Pajarita]

The technique the breeder suggested falls within a category called 'flooding' (you can do research on this on your own if you wish) and it's no longer recommended as it either breaks the bird's spirit or creates distrust of humans that lasts a lifetime. Please do not consult a breeder when it comes to behavior modification techniques. Think about it, when it's the only time a little bird gets grabbed by its body in the wild? Answer: when a predator does it with its mouth! So how could grabbing a bird the same way a predator would when it wants to eat it make him like or trust you? The thing is that breeders usually do not regard the animals as companions but as producers or merchandise so, as far as they are concerned, whether the animal he sells lives a happy life or not is not relevant (I personally do not believe for one second that breeders love the animals they breed - you don't sell a beloved companion to whoever has the money to pay for it - it would be like selling your grandchildren!) And, for another, they really have no real experience in the matter.

Your bird will need a couple of months to get used to you and to learn that you can be trusted. This will only happen if you respect the bird's wishes and slowly and gradually 'trick' it into accepting new things. I use the word 'trick' because the key to a successful long term relationship with a bird is to make it so the bird believes he made the decision when, in reality, you kind of manipulate the outcome. For example, a bird that is not hand-fed will never approach you of its own if you do nothing BUT if you start by putting a little bit of, say, a millet spray between the bars right after every time you come into the room and praise it, and just keep on going, he will learn to anticipate the praise and expect the treat right after it. Once you see this is happening regularly (the bird will approach the side of the cage where you are coming from and might even hang on to the bars while looking at you), you can start holding the treat between your fingers so he gets used to taking treats from your hand. Once you achieve this, you can opening the door to the cage and putting the treat right at the very opening and, when the bird comes over and takes the treat this way, you can start target training inside the cage and the rest will be history.

[meinenj]

Thank you both so much for your advice. I hated catching her; it did not feel right to me at all. What you both said makes perfect sense to me.

Yesterday and today I did not catch her. Instead, I worked on where I placed the millet in/on my hand. She was inquisitive, touching my hand with her beak but not biting it. And if I move very slowly, I can touch her toes and body very slightly. I saw that as a positive sign.

I will be patient and look for small changes and reinforcement. I am married, so I know how to make a partner think it's their idea ;0)

Nancy

[Michael]

Breeders generally dont have a clue how to handle birds. Most of what they do involves catching birds and sticking them together to lay them little eggs full of money. Loving and developing a relationship with the bird isn't a primary objective. Don't be too dissappointed that the bird isn't tame though. Most arent and even if it were, sooner or later it would revert to being wild if you don't work with it.

[jtomalley]

Breeders generally dont have a clue how to handle birds. Most of what they do involves catching birds and sticking them together to lay them little eggs full of money. Loving and developing a relationship with the bird isn't a primary objective. Don't be too dissappointed that the bird isn't tame though. Most arent and even if it were, sooner or later it would revert to being wild if you don't work with it.

Thank you, Michael.

I'm in a similar situation, where I contacted a local bird store/breeder for advice; I adopted a young (approximately a year old and male, according to vet) black masked lovebird that was rescued from a dog's mouth. The lady that rescued him saved him from her German shepherd in her yard. According to the vet, he is most likely an escapee from a backyard breeder, as he has no chip or leg band, and I did search for his owner, but nobody claimed him. She had him checked at her vet and he was in severe shock and dehydrated from the dog incident but otherwise unhurt. However after a day at her house she decided he wasn't going to be happy on top of her refrigerator with three big dogs jumping at him. She posted on Facebook and I got in touch with her and picked him up the same day, this was in August, 2015.

I set him up in a large flight cage (30" wide x 18" deep x 36" high) with many natural perches, a good mix of pellet and seeds and plenty of fruit and veggies. I try and work with him several times a day for 5-10 minutes at a time, but so far he hasn't gotten over his extreme fear of everything. He freaks out when his cage is approached, unless I approach very slowly and sing to him or whistle. I was able to get him to eat a bit of millet if I held a long piece to him and stood very still and sang to him, but he panicked and flapped around his cage frantically when I moved my hand to take it out. I'm afraid he might hurt himself.

It's obvious "Houdini" wasn't hand fed as a baby, so I contacted the bird store to ask if there is any hope at all that I will be able to gain his trust. He seems so sad and scared all the time, I don't want his life to be just filled with fear of me. His life so far has been so scary between dogs and car rides in boxes and vets and wing clips. I have put him in a bright spot in my living room so he has daily exposure to people, and he does chirp and play, but he won't let anyone near him.

The bird store guy came back with the "hold him with a towel and pet him until he calms down" idea, and all I could think was that would give the poor little bird a heart attack because he'd think he was back in the dog.

[Wolf]

JTOMalley,
It appears that you are doing fine for now with what you have done so fare. Patience is going to be your greatest tool with this bird given the nature of the trauma that he has recently suffered. Talking and singing softly to him along with not looking directly at him will help him to relax and get accustomed to your presence. I would like to present a few more suggestions for your consideration.
I am not sure what you mean by a bright spot, but I am hoping that while it means that the cage is near a window, that it is not directly in front of a window. It would also help the bird to feel more secure if at least one side of the cage is along a wall so that the bird feels safe from that direction.
When approaching this bird, you have already learned to sing and talk to it softly, but you do need to observe its behavior as you approach and that is where looking at the bird sideways or from the corners of your eyes will help. We are a predator species and most of the predators have binocular vision just like we have and so look head on at its prey and you want to not do this to the bird. You want to approach the cage only when the bird relaxes. A bird that is relaxed will perch with feathers slightly puffed, not held tightly to the body and may also perch on one foot. If the bird acts like it is nervous then wait for it to relax before going closer. I would spend time near the birds cage while not apparently paying attention to the bird, again just so he gets used to your presence.
Offer the millet only through the bars of the cage and don't reach inside the birds cage other than as required to clean or change out food and water. When the bird relaxes enough that he comes to the side of the cage that you are on in anticipation of your interaction and or treats then you can open the door to the cage and offer the treats to the bird at the door of the cage. You still do not want to reach in the cage. Let the bird come to you. The bird that comes to you on its own is trusting you and this is what you want. Once the bird is coming to you at the door of the cage you may want to hold his treat so that he needs to step onto your hand to get the treat. Just go slow and if he won't step onto your hand then go back to him just taking the treat from your hand, Backing up to where the bird is comfortable is never wrong and will help set the bird up to succeed later.
Hope this will help you.

[liz]

Breeders set the birds up to be terrified by clipping their wing just before you get them. They should never have their wings clipped and definatly not when he is being taken to a alien place by a giant he does not know.

[Pajarita]

Yep, all good advice so just a couple of comments. If you cannot set up the cage against a wall, use a large material draped over a corner so you make a little, safe hideaway for him where he can feel protected. Make sure the perch in there places his body at your eye level when you are standing up (little birds don't like giant aliens looming over them). Approach his cage not in a straight line but in a kind of circuitous route, stopping here and there without looking at him directly but always checking his body language so you can find the 'stress-free' distance so, as soon as you see him tensing up, take a step back and mark the spot mentally as the 'good' distance. If you can, sit down there and do something like reading, watching TV, doing computer work, playing video games, whatever activity will keep you there for a while. And, although you will not be looking at him all the time, you need to talk, sing, whistle to him so he doesn't only get used to your physical presence but also to your voice. Use praise profusely (they know the difference in tones of voice and it's useful for them to realize what is praise because you can use this later on for training him). Every now and then, offer him a treat but, if he doesn't take (and he won't at the beginning), leave it there for him to eat after you move away a bit. Eventually, he will approach the side of the cage to take the treat (they are smart little things!).

Now, I know that everybody wants his/her own little loving birdy and it's not that I don't see the attraction in that because I certainly do! But, some species of parrots really do much, much better with companions of their own so I would ask that you consider adopting him (do you know it's a him or are you assuming?) a mate. In my personal experience, once you bond with them, they don't stop loving you even if they get a mate so, although his/her need for your company will, in a way, diminish a bit, it will not really disappear and, taking into consideration that we can't be there for them 24/7/365 -which is what nature meant for them- giving them a mate makes such a big difference in their wellbeing that it is the kindest thing one can do for them.

[jtomalley]

Thank you all!

Houdini's cage is against a wall, open in front and the window is nearby on one side. The other side is near a corner but not dark. I had no choice in the wing clipping thing -- the lady who rescued him from her dog took him to her vet to be checked out after that event and the vet did it, before I even had him.

He's been DNA sexed as male and has been checked out for the various health problems that he might carry, so I do know he's healthy. He eats well, and plays with his toys. He's quiet and not terribly active when I'm in the room with him and spends a lot of time cuddled in his corner where he has a piece of micro-fleece attached to the corner of the cage. My other rescue lovebird is across the room where she has a separate cage (she is a peach faced lovebird, and she's quite a bit bigger than Houdini and is a toe biter so they are separated) - they can see each other and they do get chatty with each other, especially in the mornings.

I have a wifi camera set up near his cage so I watch him from work. He's far more active when there are no humans in the room. He especially likes his shredding toys.

I sit near him when I'm home and there's a radio on when I'm not. There's TV noise and my budgie has full run of the house when I'm home, so he can see me interacting with her as well as with the other lovebird.

I just worry that he has PTSD from his ordeal before he came to be with me. He's totally wild, as far as I can tell, and has never had human interaction that wasn't traumatic. I have no idea how his life was before the lady found him, I can only guess he was not hand fed and was a product of a backyard breeder. He is not chipped or banded.

I know he may never be a cuddle bird, but I would like it if he looked forward to seeing me and at least not be terrified of me. I drop treats in his cage and talk to him when I'm near. I don't try and engage him any further than that. I want him to learn that I'm the bringer of happy.